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Elizabeth Lloyd b 1879

SHIRLEY THOMAS nee WYATT

THE WOMEN WHO MADE ME,- MY MATERNAL GREAT GRANDMOTHER.

ELIZABETH LLOYD b 1879

Elizabeth Lloyd born 2nd January 1879, at 2a Newport Street, Lambeth, County of Surrey. Baptised on the 5th January 1879 at St Mary's, Lambeth.

the youngest child of

Frederick Edwin Lloyd and Emma Ingle

Frederick and Emma were married on the 10th December 1857 at St Mary's, Lambeth.

Both of full age, living at Walnut Tree Walk.Frederick's occupation labourer. Witnessed by William and Emily Downton.

Frederick and Emma had thirteen children

George b 1853

Louisa b 1855

John b 1857

Emma b 1858

Frederick b 1860

Edwin b 1862

Mary b 1864

Annie b 1866

Alfred b 1868

Emily b 1872

Charles b 1874

Henry b 1877

Elizabeth b 1879

The same year that Elizabeth was born her mother died.

Emma died aged 45, Oct-Nov-Dec, Lambeth, Greater London,London, Surrey. Vol 1d, page 274.

This area of Greater London was very poor,with bad housing and much crime.

St Mary's Church is next to Lambeth Palace.The residence of the Bishop of London.

It is situated by the River Thames.

The 1861 census shows that Frederick and Emma lived at 27 James St, Lambeth.

Frederick Edwin age 36, occupation labourer.

Emma age 27, occupation Dressmaker.

George age 8

Louisa age 6

John age 4

Emma age 2

Frederick age 6 months

John Ingle age 57, Grandfather, occupation Blind Maker.

The 1871 census shows

Frederick age 40 occupation unemployed

Emma age 37

John age 14 occupation unemployed

Frederick age 10

Edwin age 8

Mary age 6

Annie age 4

The children missing are George age 18

Louisa age 16

Emma age 12

These children would have left home to find work

Alfred would have been age only 3 so must have died young.

The 1881 census shows

Frederick is shown as Edwin age 56, widower, occupation Gas Lampshade Maker.

Emily age 10

Charles age 7

Henry age 4

Elizabeth age 2

George age 60, brother, widower, Artist in Paintings.

The family are living at 2 Newport Street, Lambeth.

Eight of the children would have left home and one was deceased.

Elizabeth had never known her mother.

So many of her brothers and sisters were much older than her. Some had children the same age as Elizabeth.

In 1886 Elizabeth was aged about 8 years.

Her father Frederick Edwin Lloyd age 61, married Rebecca Hosier age 27.

 

The 1891 census shows

Frederick age 66 occupation Shade Maker.

Rebecca age 32

Charles age 17 occupation General Labourer.

Henry age 14 occupation General Labourer.

Mostyn age 3.

So Emily is now 20 and Elizabeth, now age 12, has left home.

The 1891 census shows Elizabeth is a General Servant.

Age given as 16, but she was only 13.

She was working for a Mr Edwyn Goshawk, occ, Tobacconist Assistant.

His wife and two young daughters.

At 57 Ravenswood Rd, Streatham, London.

Most children went to work at a very young age.

What happened to all these brothers and sisters?

George b 1853 Kingsland Surrey.( Age 26 when Elizabeth was born.)

He was born before his parents' marriage and his mother Emma was age 19.

He was baptised on the 1st April 1860 at St Mary's, Lambeth.

Age 14 he was given 4 years in a Reformatory for larceny.

On the 18th Oct 1880 imprisoned for (unlawfully uttering counterfeit coins.)

The 1881 census when Elizabeth was age 2, shows her eldest brother in prison.

George age 28, unmarried, Prisoner

Her Majesty's Prison, Wandsworth Common, London.

Occ, Gas (Fitter)Shade Maker. The same occupation as his Father.

Louisa b 1855.

Baptised with her brother George on 1st April 1860.

She was married at age 21, on the 18th Jan 1875 to James Box.  

Witness to the marriage Emily Dowton ( witness to her mother's marriage).

There were no children and on the 12th July 1875 James was imprisoned for coining offences at The Old Bailey.(The same as her brother George).

Louisa died in 1915 age 59 an inmate at Lambeth Workhouse.

John b 1856,( also as George and Louisa, before his parents married.)

Baptised 21st Dec 1856, St Mary's, Lambeth.

He married age 21 on 1st Oct 1876 St Mary's, Lambeth to Eliza Ann Lock.(Witness his younger sister Emma Lloyd.) They had two children, John Wilkinson and Eliza Jane.

Age 14 he was unemployed but after that had many different jobs.

Green  Grocer, Carman, Cabinet Maker and then a Carpet Planner.

In 1881 the census showed his younger brother Edwin age 18 living with his family.

The 1911 census he was living with his daughter in Manchester.

John died Dec 1927 age 70.

Emma b 1858.

Baptised 31st Oct 1858, St Mary's, Lambeth.

Age 12 she was a servant and then by 1881, the census shows that she is age 23 and a Pupil Nurse. Great Ormond St Hospital for Sick Children.

Later age 32 was living at Margate, a Trained Medical Nurse.

Frederick b 25 Sep 1860. Baptised 14 Oct 1860, St Mary's, Soho,Westminster, London.

He married age 20 on 6th August 1883 to Elizabeth Wilks.

His occ was a Stoker and then later a House Decorator.

The 1891 census shows they have two children Annie and Frederick.

Edwin b 1863.

On 20th May 1883 he married Annie Riley.

His occ Carman.

The 1891 census shows two children Willie and Richard.

The 1901 census only included Willie and two more children Elsie and Sidney.

He died in 1947 aged 85.

Mary was baptised 22 may 1864, St Mary, Soho, Westminster, London.

1871 age 6 living with the family.

1891 age 26, patient/idiot, Metropolitan District Asylum, Godstone, Caterham, Surrey.

She died aged 29 at Godstone Surrey.

Annie baptised 19th August 1866, St Mary, Soho, Westminster, London.

In 1890 age 22 she married Charles Edward Dunsford.

They had 14 children.

There was one set of twins with one twin living only one year.

A son William was a Private in the 3rd Hussars.

A daughter Lillian died age 23, shot by her husband Richard Hershall Steward.

Annie's husband Charles occ was House Painter and Decorator. He died 4th Jan 1939, at 48 Alexandra Road, Turnpike Lane, Hornsey. Leaving £144 in his will to Annie.

She died age 78,  and is buried on the 18th July 1946 at Islington Cemetery

 

Alfred b 1868, July-Aug-Sept quarter, St George, Southwark, London.

Died the same July-Aug-Sept quarter, St George, Southwark, London.

Baptised 19 August 1868, All Saints, Lambeth, Surrey.

Emily b 28 Dec 1871, baptised 21 Jan 1872 at St Mary's,Lambeth.

In 1879 her mother Emma died at age 45.

Oct -Nov-Dec, Lambeth, Greater London,London, Surrey.

Vol 1d

Page 274.

The 1881 census shows Emily age 10 living with her brothers, sister and her father.

Emily would have had to help look after her brothers and little sister.

On the 30th Sept 1886 her father, age 61 married Rebecca Hosier.

The 1891 census shows that Emily age 19 is a servant/nurse, Eton College, Buckinghamshire.

Age 25 Emily marries Fred Wilson age 22.The 2nd August 1897,St Lukes, Bermondsey. Witness by C Lloyd (brother) and Frank Wilson (Freds twin brother).

The 1901 census shows Emily age 29, Fred age 25. Also her father Frederick Lloyd age 76. Living at 60 Willow Walk, Bermondsey.

1902 Frederick died aged 77, Strood,Kent.

After her father dies many things happen to Emily.

Emily meets a man who called himself William Pye, occ barman.He had changed his name after leaving his wife. He came from Newcastle-u-Lyme,and had three children. His name was Sampson Mifflin.

Emily and her sister Elizabeth also sang together on the stage in music halls.

A good way of earning extra money.

They sang at The Alhambra Theatre, London.

1911 Fred Wilson divorced Emily who was then age 41. He went back to live with his parents and twin brother.

Emily had many children with William Pye ( Sampson Mifflin).

Adelaide 1903-1903

Maud 1904-1992

Edward 1905-1981

George 1906-1961

John Reginald 1908-1991

Wilfred Percy Arthur 1909-1982

Emily Mabel 1911-1992

Henry Herbert 1913-1991

William Robert 1915-1918

On the birth certificate of Edward Pye born 15 May 1905 at St Pancras, London. Father occ bar or publican work,living at 56 Liverpool St, Islington.

The 1911 shows Emily age 39 living with William Pye age 42.

His occ window cleaner, living in two rooms at 3 Little George St, London NW.

It says they have been married for 8 years. Emily was divorced by Fred Wilson in 1911. So she could not have married William but had lived with him since the birth of their first child in 1903.

On the war records of 1939 shows

Emily Pye b 28 Dec 1871 divorced, old age pensioner

Sampson Mifflin b 4 Sept 1868, old age pensioner

All the children knew their father as Bill Pye.

He died 24 August 1942, Southend-on Sea, Essex.

Emily then told her son Wilfred that his father's real name was Sampson Mifflin and to register this on the death cert.

Emily died at age 78 on the 4th August 1949.

Charles b 1874, baptised 2 Jan 1874.

The 1881 census he was age 7 living with his family, his mother is deceased.

1891 census age 17 occ, general labourer, living with father, stepmother,brother Henry age 14 occ gen lab.

Also half brother Mostyn is 3. Living in two rooms 9 High St, Lambeth.

On the 7th of July 1898 age 24 he married Elizabeth Strange age 30, witness brother in -law Fred Wilson.

1901 age 27 occupation Railway Engine Fireman

Wife Elizabeth age 32

Son Charles age 2

Living 7 All Saints Rd, Northfleet, Kent.

1911 age 37 Railway Engine Driver

Elizabeth age 42

Charles Horace age 12

Frederick John age 9

Elizabeth Gladys age 7,  b 19 Nov 1903.

Albert Edward age 5

Queenie Gertrude age 2

Living at 9 Beaufoy Rd, Lavender Hill, SW.

His Daughter Elizabeth went to the Battersea Notre Dame School for one year 1916-17. They lived at 11 St Andrews St, Wandsworth Rd, London SW.

He died at St James Hospital, Balham, Surrey on the 1st Mar 1939.

Home address 11 St Rule St, Battersea, Surrey.

Leaving the sum of £370 to son Albert Edward.

Henry b 21 Aug 1876, baptised 10 Sept 1876. St Mary, Lambeth.

1881 age 2, living with Father, mother deceased, at 2 Newport St, Lambeth.

1891 age 14,occ Labourer, living with Father and Step mother Rebecca.

1901

On 20 Jan 1906 married Annie Benham age 25, witnessed by his sister Annie and her husband Charles Dunsford.

Henry was 29 and occ Painter. Living at 2 Haringay Rd, Hornsey, Middlesex.

1911 age 34, occ Gen Lab at London General Omnibus Co.

Annie age 33

Annie Florence age 4 - m 1929 John R Westwood.

Norah Mary age 1

Living at 5 Holland Rd, High St, Hornsey.

The 1939 war records shows

Henry b 21 Aug 1876  Incapacitated.

Annie b 9 Mar 1881

Nora M Williams widow b 23 Jan 1910  Private Means.

Living at 43 Everington Rd, Hornsey,Middlesex.

My Great Grandmother Elizabeth born 2 Jan 1879

Her mother Emma died at the end of that year age 45.

Emma had born 13 children, one died at birth and one was classed as a lunatic. From age 19 to 45 she bore children

1853

1855

1857

1858

1860

1862

1864

1866

1868

1872

1874

1877

1879

After Emma died her husband Frederick re married and there were three more children.

These would be half brothers and sister to Elizabeth.

Fredrick, aged 61 married Rebecca Hosier age 27 in 1886.

They had three children.

Mostyn b 1887

Charlotte Victoria b 1894

James Thomas b 1902.

 

So my great grandmother Elizabeth had a brother who was 26 years older than her. Also a half brother who was 23 years younger than her and the same age as her children.

Elizabeth must have had so many cousins, nieces and nephews.

The family was enormous.

So Elizabeth was born 1879.

On the 1891 census she had left home and found work.

Her Father Frederick had a sister called Charlotte Brown she had a son called John Charles Brown born 1868.

At some point they met and married on the 21st May 1899 at Christchurch Southwark. John age 30 occ Tailor, Elizabeth age 20.

Living at 39 Colingwood St.

They had five children.

Elizabeth Charlotte b 5 Jan 1900.

Edith Alice b 26 Nov 1901.

Rosina Emma b 14 Nov 1904

John Frederick Mostyn b  25 Feb1909

Frederick C W b 25 July 1913

In the 1901 census the family were living at 79 Butlocks Heath,Southampton.

They have rooms,living with the family of George Woods.

John C Brown aged 32, Private,RAMC,(Royal Army Medical Corp).

Elizabeth aged 22

Elizabeth C aged 1

In the 1911 census they were living back in London.68 Neal St, WC.

John Charles Brown aged 40, occupation Tailor Journeyman.

Elizabeth aged 32

Elizabeth Charlotte aged 11

Edith Alice aged 9

Rosina Emma aged 6

John Frederick Mostyn aged 2.

My grandmother Elizabeth Charlotte can remember her mother and her Aunt Emily dressed in beautiful gowns. They would go in a horse drawn hackney carriage. This was to perform in the music halls singing. One of the theatres was The Alhambra.

In about 1914 my great grandmother left her husband and five children. She went to live with her agent. Her youngest child was only one year old.

It was said that she went on to have two more sons with this man. After John had moved his family to live in Bristol, Elizabeth and her agent appeared and John let them stay the night as they had nowhere to go. My great grandmother would not acknowledge my grandmother, introducing her to this man as her sister.

What happened to my great grandmother after this I do not know.

Did she divorce?

Did she change her name?

We may never find out ,but her granddaughter also called Elizabeth( my mother) would have loved to find out. She said that she was the grandmother I never knew.

On reflection looking at the life of my maternal great grandmother Elizabeth it must have been hard.

Her mother died when she was a baby.

Who looked after her?

Was it her sister Emily only 8 years older or another sister.

Her Father was an older man of about age 54 when she was born.

Then age 8 her father remarried.

At about 13 she was working as a general servant for a family with small children.

Her family seemed to be musical and had friends who were entertainers.

To make extra money Elizabeth sang with her sister Emily. Elizabeth also played the Mandolin.

Then she married  her first cousin John Charles Brown, a man ten years older than herself. They had five children.

He was a Tailor by trade but then was also an Army Reservist in the Medical Core.

Her second child was born in Southampton. John was stationed at Netley where injured soldiers were nursed back to health.This was from the Boer War.

After he was discharged they returned to London.

John set up a double fronted shop, one side for mens clothes the other for ladies. He set up a thriving business. The family had a cleaner. They were never short of food. He paid for his children to go to school. It was just around the corner from where they lived. St Martins in the Fields. Trafalgar Square.

Then Elizabeth and Emily must both have met men of whom they left their husbands. Elizabeth her agent and Emily, Sampson Mifflin known as William Pye.

The photo of Elizabeth was carried in the wallet of her husband John Charles Brown for the rest of his life.

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